Farouk al-Qaddoumi: We Visited Assad and He Ordered Arafat’s Release from Mezzeh Prison

Yasser Arafat, Farouk al-Qaddoumi and other Palestinian officials pray at the graves of victims of a 1985 Israeli raid on the PLO headquarters in Tunis in 2001. (AFP)
Yasser Arafat, Farouk al-Qaddoumi and other Palestinian officials pray at the graves of victims of a 1985 Israeli raid on the PLO headquarters in Tunis in 2001. (AFP)
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Farouk al-Qaddoumi: We Visited Assad and He Ordered Arafat’s Release from Mezzeh Prison

Yasser Arafat, Farouk al-Qaddoumi and other Palestinian officials pray at the graves of victims of a 1985 Israeli raid on the PLO headquarters in Tunis in 2001. (AFP)
Yasser Arafat, Farouk al-Qaddoumi and other Palestinian officials pray at the graves of victims of a 1985 Israeli raid on the PLO headquarters in Tunis in 2001. (AFP)

No history of the Arab world in the past seven decades could be written without stopping at length at the Palestinian Fatah movement. The history of the movement itself cannot be written without stopping at one of its founders, Farouk al-Qaddoumi (Abu al-Lutf), who passed away on Thursday at the age of 94.

Qaddoumi was one of the original founders of the movement in 1965, alongside Yasser Arafat, Salah Khalaf, and Khalil al-Wazir. He had moved away from the spotlight in the past 30 years over his opposition to the Oslo Accord and concern that Israel would use it against the Palestinian leadership and its people.

Before that, Qaddoumi was a prominent Palestinian figure who championed the cause as foreign minister of the Palestine Liberation Organization at international meetings. He was clear and firm in his speeches before the United Nations, Arab and Islamic summits and others.

A member of the Baath party, I asked him one day of his thoughts about Arafat (Abu Ammar) and his sole leadership of the Palestinians. He replied: “Abu Ammar is the leader of the Fatah tribe. According to our norms, the tribe leader enjoys privileges that others don't.” Whatever reservations he had about Arafat never led him to question his position as the top Palestinian leader.

I met Qaddoumi in Tunis in 1998 and will share some moments of that meeting in Asharq Al-Awsat in wake of his passing:

Early years

*How was the Fatah movement born?

Acts of resistance emerged after the occupation of Gaza in 1956. The Arab world was also being swept up in revolts from Algeria to Iraq and others. This left an impact on us. In fact, the success of the revolution in Algeria helped spur freedom fighter, “fidai”, work in our region.

Palestine’s Grand Mufti Amin al-Husseini had, during his stay in Egypt and then Lebanon, advocated for Palestinian resistance and struggle. The Higher Arab Commission existed at the time, paving the way eventually for the fidai movement. The armed struggle was also prompted by the lack of political achievements at the time.

With the dour political mood, Algeria’s independence was a beacon of hope that inspired the formation of fidai movements, and so Fatah began to take shape in Kuwait and later Qatar in the late 1950s and early 1960s. The formation of Fatah would pave the way for the formation of the PLO in 1964.

*When did you meet Arafat for the first time?

I was in Cairo in 1954. Along with Arafat, Salah Khalaf (Abu Iyad), and I were members of the General Union of Palestine Students. Arafat was its president. I was a student at the American university, Arafat was a student at Cairo University and Abu Iyad went to al-Azhar University.

I was a member of the Baath part, Abu Iyad of the enlightened Muslim Brotherhood and Arafat was religious but independent. We spent three years in Cairo. Arafat graduated and then headed to Kuwait where he worked as an engineer. He was followed by Abu Iyad and I worked in the health ministry. I took up positions in Libya, then Saudi Arabia and later Kuwait in 1960.

We didn’t hold meetings together. Rather, we limited our talks to bilateral contacts to maintain secrecy. I used to get in touch with Arafat, and he with Abu Iyad. Adel Abdel Karim used to coordinate our meetings. Among the Fatah founders were Abu al-Adeeb and Khaled al-Hassan.

The central committee was formed later and it began to meet as a group in 1965. For years, we made contacts with brothers throughout the region, especially Arab and Palestinian national figures, including figures in Algeria, Saudi Arabia and other countries.

Farouk al-Qaddoumi at an Organization of Islamic Cooperation conference in Malaysia in 2003. (Getty Images)

*How was the official launch of Fatah decided in 1965?

We debated whether to announce the formation of Fatah before the establishment of the PLO in 1964 or after. In the end, we decided to reinforce resistance movements and to garner Arab support for the Palestinian national identity embodied in the PLO. This facilitated the way for armed struggle and fidai operations.

The national congress was held in Jerusalem in 1964. It brought together Arafat, Khaled al-Hassan and others. It was followed by a resistance operation that called for striking water pipelines in northern Palestine. The fighters came in from the Syrian border. The operation resulted in our first prisoner Mahmoud Hijazi and first martyr Ahmed Moussa.

We later formed a “revolutionary council”, regional committees and a central committee.

*What was Arafat’s position during that time?

He was first appointed deputy to the general commander, Abu Youssef al-Najjar. He rose to general commander in 1966 and named official spokesman. I chaired the inaugural meeting of the central committee and was named its secretary.

*Where there any disputes between members during the early days of the central committee?

Fatah embodied work, ideology and organization. Meaning we enrich our thought and organization, and improve our work through operations and experiences on the ground. We used to say that carrying arms was the foundation of our work and that the purpose of carrying arms was not financial or material, but rather, it had national, moral and noble goals.

We were initially accused to roping in Egypt and Gamal Abdul Nasser in our operations. We were also accused of poorly timing our operations. We were accused of being an Arab nationalist movement. Soon, however, our armed struggle began to bear fruit and raise the morale of the people.

The Karameh battle of 1968 gave Fatah an accomplishment. With the defeat of the Arab armies in 1967, the people yearned for the formation of a revolutionary movement. People turned to Fatah and we built foundations along the River Jordan. Eventually our work became more organized and we reached out to various Palestinian groups to unite under a single banner and so, the PLO was formed with Arafat at the helm.

*How were relations with Abdel Nasser?

We always sought to establish ties with him. We tried to meet him once in late 1965 or early 1966. I was accompanied by Arafat and Mahmoud Sawda. We couldn’t manage an audience with him and instead were met with the head of intelligence. At the time, the Palestinian revolution had not yet rose to prominence and swept headlines. It was not the focus of attention in Egypt or by its president.

That changed after the 1967 defeat of Arab armies. We met with Mohammed Hassanein Haykal, who facilitated a meeting with Abdel Nasser.

Abdel Nasser loved Arafat and saw in him the spirit of Arab youths who had hope in the future. In 1969, Abdel Nasser invited Arafat to join him on a trip to the Soviet Union and so, relations between Moscow and the PLO were forged.

Syrian President Hafez al-Assad. (Getty Images)

Ties with Syria

*When did you meet Syrian President Hafez al-Assad?

We’ve known each other since the 1960s when he was defense minister. In 1966, two Fatah officers were killed during an argument in Syria. Soon after, Syrian authorities imprisoned the Fatah leadership of Arafat, Mamdouh Saidam, Walid Ahmad Nimr, al-Wazir and others. Eleven leading members were sent to jail.

Along with a colleague, I traveled to Syria to tackle the situation. We contacted Salah Jadid, Hafez al-Assad and Ahmed Sweidan. The meeting with Assad was good. The truth was that Arafat and his comrades were suspected of being members of the Muslim Brotherhood. They were surprised to learn that I was part of the Palestinian revolution and knew that I was not a member of the Brotherhood, but of the Baath party.

Arafat was jailed for some 51 days in Mezzeh prison where he came under investigation. We sought out Assad, who was defense minister. We told him that we had heard rumors that the Syrian leadership wanted to execute the detainees. “Who told you this?” he asked. We told him that they were rumors we heard in Damascus. He replied: “Please, come and receive them.” And so, we secured the release of Arafat and the others.

Later, Arafat took part in an operation from Lebanese territories and was arrested by the Lebanese army. It also arrested the Palestinian group that carried out the operation. Through Syrian mediation, we succeeded in securing Arafat’s release.

*The Syrian and Palestinian leaderships had thorny relations. What was the toughest moment that you experienced with it?

The 1976 period when the Syrian army was deployed to Lebanon was the most difficult. The “national movement” in Lebanon was opposed to the deployment. We believed that the deployment would lead to a clash with the Palestinian revolution.

*Some Palestinians accused Syria of trying to seize Palestinian decision-making.

It wasn’t about seizing this power. The Palestinian cause was the top issue for Syria and the focus of its concern, otherwise it would never have offered us what it did. Assad and Syrian officials had repeatedly said that the Palestinians control Syrian decision-making, not the other way around.

Our relations with Assad were strong and coordination was always ongoing. Assad long underscored the strategic alliance between Syria and the Palestinian revolution. He is a member of the Baath and perhaps this background allows me to understand him since we are both members of the party. At the time, more than 60 percent of Syria’s budget went to supporting the Palestinian cause.

*Did Assad have reservations about the Palestinian resistance in Lebanon?

Not until the clash happened with the Syrian army. That prompted the question: Why did the Palestinian resistance oppose the deployment of the Syrian military? Assad is a calm, patient and persevering person. He listens to everyone and can discuss several issues at length. He has the patience that is lacking in several leaders and heads of state.

Iraqi President Saddam Hussein receives Farouk al-Qaddoumi in Baghdad in 2002. (Getty Images)

Ties with Iraq

*What about your relations with Saddam Hussein?

We met Saddam in Cairo and used to travel to Baghdad, which had opened its doors to us after the Karameh battle. We even opened offices in Baghdad. Sabri al-Banna's (Abu Nidal) defection from Fatah though, created tensions between Iraq and the PLO.

*It was believed that the Iraqi leadership was influencing Banna.

Yes, we also sensed that. But Iraq acted out of a clear political vision. Iraq never hides its stances.

*What about Saddam?

He tried to understand who he was speaking with him. He was calm and focused on the person talking to him. He was never severe in dealing with us. Our requests were quickly met. He was generous with us and even more so after he became president. Iraq gave us so much. Iraq offered the PLO greater support after it was forced out of Beirut. The tensions between the PLO and Syria also helped bring us closer to Baghdad.

*Was Iraq a main backer of the PLO?

The truth is Saudi Arabia was. It provided us with so much. We must be fair in saying that Gulf countries helped the Palestinian people a lot.



‘Caesar’s’ Partner ‘Sami’ to Asharq Al-Awsat: ‘Coalition’ Support Helped Extend Assad’s Time in Power

A portrait of Syrian President Bashar al-Assad is pictured with its frame broken, in a Syrian regime's Political Security Branch facility on the outskirts of the central city of Hama, following the capture of the area by anti-government forces, on December 7, 2024. (AFP)
A portrait of Syrian President Bashar al-Assad is pictured with its frame broken, in a Syrian regime's Political Security Branch facility on the outskirts of the central city of Hama, following the capture of the area by anti-government forces, on December 7, 2024. (AFP)
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‘Caesar’s’ Partner ‘Sami’ to Asharq Al-Awsat: ‘Coalition’ Support Helped Extend Assad’s Time in Power

A portrait of Syrian President Bashar al-Assad is pictured with its frame broken, in a Syrian regime's Political Security Branch facility on the outskirts of the central city of Hama, following the capture of the area by anti-government forces, on December 7, 2024. (AFP)
A portrait of Syrian President Bashar al-Assad is pictured with its frame broken, in a Syrian regime's Political Security Branch facility on the outskirts of the central city of Hama, following the capture of the area by anti-government forces, on December 7, 2024. (AFP)

In the second installment of his interview with Asharq Al-Awsat, Osama Othman, who smuggled files of torture that took place in the Syrian regime’s jails, recalled how he and his partner “Caesar” were shocked at how dismissive leader of the opposition “Syrian national coalition” government was of their case.

Othman, known by his codename “Sami”, said that with this attitude, the coalition helped extend the term of now ousted President Bashar al-Assad. “His reckless attitude cost us tens of thousands of lives,” he told Asharq Al-Awsat.

*We last stopped at the issuance of the “Caesar Act”. What happened next?

The Act was issued when the world was least interested in the Syrian revolution and the plight of the people. So, we established in the United States and later in Paris organizations that have now become the Caesar Files for Justice. The platform is now following up on the legal proceedings related to the Caesar file and others.

I can’t reveal what some of those files are yet, but of course, they are about the Syrian regime’s human rights violations. Some are also related to the impact its practices have had on the economy through its systematic destruction and demographic change it was imposing on the people. We believe that everyone who committed violations in Syria must be held to account.

Some of the violations include the illegal naturalization of people so that Assad could establish what he once called the “beneficial Syria” and a “homogeneous society”. These statements were backed by action on the ground, but whose details I can’t disclose yet because I don’t want to expose people involved in the file.

*The media had spoken of Iranians and Shiite Iraqis who were naturalized. Is this issue covered in the file?

Yes, it is. When you learn that your neighbor speaks a foreign language and acts as though he has been living in Syria for decades, you have to wonder where they came from and who brought them here. Every Syrian used to wonder who these people were. The people handling this file are Syrians who want to protect their country from this systematic and non-systematic demographic change.

This leads us to what I call the massacre that was committed against the evidence, documents and archives, not just at the security branches and prisons, but at other institutions. We all saw how the passports directorate was bombed. These places are very important because they held a lot of evidence and information. When places that important are bombed, it is to hide evidence and documents. The strikes that took place after Assad fled the country are just more crimes added to his list of violations against Syria.

*Are you saying that Assad’s agencies and Israel were working together?

I can’t make such accusations. All I am saying is that such incidents became more frequent after he fled, and you can draw your own conclusions.

Anti-government fighters gather in front of the Kuweires military airfield and academy in the eastern part of Aleppo province on December 1, 2024. (AFP)

Hezbollah Saved Assad

*Who turned the tables in Syria and extended Assad and the regime’s time in power? Do you believe the Russians were involved in the violations? What about the Iranian militias and Hezbollah?

We nearly hung posters of Hezbollah leader Hassan Nasrallah in our homes in 2006. We used to weep when we learned about the martyrdom of its members. In 2006, I hosted a Lebanese family in my home in Wadi Barada in northern Damascus.

Hezbollah had openly declared that if it weren’t for its intervention, Assad would have fallen within months. That’s enough. Nasrallah said it himself and Hezbollah’s actions on the ground back his statements. So, certainly Hezbollah’s intervention in the early years of the conflict was decisive for the regime.

Other militias came pouring through soon after and we started to notice foreigners in our country. We used to hear gunmen speak in foreign languages as they roamed our streets. Right in front of my house were several people who didn’t speak a word of Arabic. They observed a peaceful rally that was mourning a martyr killed by regime shelling on the city. I never dared ask the strangers where they came from and what they were doing here. You could easily spot the foreigners in our city of al-Tall in the Damascus countryside.

They came in months after Hezbollah’s intervention. Then came Russia’s intervention in 2015 which was the most decisive. This led the rebels to become constrained to specific regions and losing territories they had captured from the regime. Iran, Russia and the militias were partners with the regime in killing the Syrian people and destroying their country. It doesn’t take much effort to prove this.

Close Calls

*Did the regime ever come close to discovering the Caesar files?

My family’s house in al-Tall was once raided by the regime. They were searching for my youngest brother because he had taken part in a peaceful demonstration or some normal everyday thing which we all did. The members of the “political security” branch raided our home. This was at the beginning of the revolution and the officer in charge still showed some decency and respect.

He came into the house and carried out his search. He took the computers that I used for my work as a civil engineer. He had found it in my brother’s room. He took everything related to the computer. I remember the officer’s name was Mohammed Jomaa. When he learned that I was a civil engineer, he lectured me about patriotism and how the nation had spared no expense so that we could earn an education – slogans that regime members are forced to memorize during indoctrination sessions.

He took my ID and told me I should head to Damascus to get it and that I should bring my brother too to collect the computer. So, I remained without an ID for some time. I couldn’t even leave my city because showing up at any checkpoint without identification would have gotten me arrested. Had I been arrested, I would have ended up as one of the Caesar file photos.

During another incident, al-Tall was being invaded by the regime after a long battle with the rebels inside the city and the displacement of nearly all its residents. I had taken my parents and siblings to the nearby city of Seydnaya and stayed home. My youngest brother could not leave al-Tall and I wanted to remain with him and to also protect the data we had. My third brother insisted on remaining with us and so we did. We were searched by the security forces on numerous occasions.

The Free Syrian Army soon withdrew from the city and the regime forces swept in, committing several massacres in al-Tall. We were then forced to flee the building we were staying in. We couldn’t stay in our own home because it was located at the entrance of the city where the invasion had begun. So, I hid the camera I had and some equipment under a pile of garbage below the building. I thought to myself: “I’ll be able to find them should I survive because the forces won’t think about searching in the garbage for such things.”

We managed to flee the city and remained away for five or six days before returning to al-Tall. It was a holiday, so security had become a bit lax and phone services were restored. While in hiding, we witnessed how a tank and sniper had taken up position on higher ground. They were ready to attack anyone who passed through the area. The three of us had basically escaped with our lives.

Syria’s seat and the flag of the revolution are seen at an Arab League summit in Doha in 2013. (AFP)

Coalition Gives Assad Indirect Support

*Aside from the regime, did anyone try to undermine, obstruct or exploit your work?

In a way, yes. Our main battle after leaving Syria was aimed at preserving this file and keeping it away from political meddling. This file is about human rights violations. It belongs to all Syrians and it should be kept away from narrow interests. At first, the coalition tried to present itself as the sponsor of the file, which was a normal thing to do.

I approached them with a friend and met with the head of the government. I was in the waiting room for four hours with people drinking tea and coffee as if they were in a cafe. It was unfortunate to listen to conversations that had nothing to do with what was happening in Syria.

After four hours, we sat down for a short meeting with the head of government and explained the file to him. “We need help that would ensure that this file would be kept out of political disputes between the various members of the opposition and others. We need to protect our loved ones who are still in Syria,” we urged him. His response to this was truly shocking. “So you think this file will shake Bashar al-Assad's throne?” he told me.

The response was disappointing and unfortunate because he was someone who was supposed to be speaking on behalf of the Syrian revolution. This revolt is the most significant one since the French Revolution in 1789.

The toppling of the regime and establishment of a state of law and justice in Syria will change the Middle East and in turn, the world. This is what the French Revolution did three centuries ago. And so, for the coalition government to respond to me in such a way was very offensive. I left the meeting feeling dejected and with my thoughts with my family that we were trying to bring from Damascus.

That moment pained me deeply. I had come all this way, put myself and others in danger, only to come across someone who was there to exploit me. It was just such a shocking moment.

*So you were disappointed with the opposition?

Disappointment doesn’t even cut it. I was saddened and dejected. Had the Caesar file been handled properly, Assad wouldn’t have remained on his throne until 2024. Such a lack of responsibility. It is this attitude that extended the life of the Syrian regime and cost tens of thousands of Syrian lives.

So, for example, if you were to hold negotiations with the regime, what cards would you have if the Caesar file wasn’t one of them? What would you even talk about? The opposition spoke at international platforms of everything from the constitution to the color of the flag, language and system of rule. Not once did it bring up the issue of the detainees.

We have long said that the detainee file was above negotiations, meaning we would not negotiate with the regime over anything before we discuss this issue. Some members of the opposition interpreted this as negotiating everything and setting this issue to the side. I didn’t know whether to laugh or cry. This is why I say that the coalition helped extend the regime’s time in power.

People search for their loved ones among corpses of victims of torture at Seydnaya Prison. (AFP)

Seydnaya Prison and the Human Press

*You compared Seydnaya Prison to the Bastille and the Syrian revolution to the French one. What comes to mind when I say “Seydnaya”?

After the world saw what it was like inside Seydnaya, I can’t even imagine what it was like for people to be imprisoned there. For them to turn into numbers, then corpses and rotten bodies that are still living. They are then taken to the human press where they are turned into bones and tissue. Who could even imagine such a thing? Who could even endure such terror?

On the outside, we used to look at the prison as a symbol of oppression and injustice. These words don’t do justice to what the detainees went through for even a few minutes, so what could it even have been like for people who were held there for dozens of years? Perhaps the lucky ones were the detainees who entered the prison and were swiftly taken to the press.

*Were you surprised to learn about the press? Were you expecting to see such a thing?

It never occurred to me that the regime would use a press against humans. We had heard a lot about the different forms of torture and the mass graves, but a human press?! What kind of criminal mind did this regime have?

*What purpose did this press serve?

You and me, we are normal humans who love and feel for our relatives. We think soundly. This is not a question that can be answered by people who think reasonably. What could possibly prompt a criminal regime, which has the whole of Syria, to bring in a press to turn corpses into dust. The prison itself has thousands of meters of territory. Just bury the corpses there. No normal person could have operated the press.

Small Butchers and Senior Officers

*Can you name any of the big butchers who were responsible for the torture?

The list is long. We had filed lawsuits against several people before the German judiciary, including deputy chief of security affairs Ali Mamlouk, deputy director of national security and former head of military intelligence Abdel Fattah Qadsiye, and head of air force intelligence and Mazzeh prison warden Jamil al-Hassan. Hassan was the target of the first arrest warrant issued by the German judiciary.

The heads of security branches are directly responsible for the killing under torture, but they are not the only ones responsible. I have always said that arresting the head of the security branch and charging him with war crimes is not as important as issuing charges against the person who carried out the actual killing and torture in these jails. These are the people who enjoyed the killing. They don’t just kill because they were ordered to do so; they do it because they relish torturing people, and the result are the images that we have seen after the ouster of the regime.

They believe that they will be protected by their superiors and that they won’t be held to account. All the trials that have been held outside of Syria were dedicated to trying top rank officials or people who were proven to have committed murder. This is not enough. We must get the names of the people who carried out the direct killings so that they realize that the regime that they worshipped like God does not protect them.

People look through documents at the Seydnaya prison in Damascus on December 11, 2024. (AFP)

*Are the documents that have been collected enough to indict the smaller employees? Are there any names?

If you mean the Caesar files, which we took out of Syria in 2013, they only have a limited number of photos of regime members. Some names are there through signatures on documents, but that doesn’t necessarily mean that they were the ones who tortured and killed the victims. Our files don’t have the names of the butchers in the jails who carried out the killing.

In order to establish a free Syria and a stable society, you must go through a period of transitional justice, which demands accountability. You cannot live in an area knowing that your neighbor still reeks of blood because he used to work for several years in Assad’s jails where he used to torture or kill detainees. So, everyone who committed human rights violations in Syria must be held to account in order for our society to become stable. We mustn't allow the opportunity for individual acts of revenge if relatives come to believe that they have not received justice against those who killed their loved ones.

The violations are not limited to killing and torture. There are so many violations. Everything that undermines human dignity is a violation, and so are attempts to create demographic change. You can’t simply tell people who lived in a tent along the Turkish border, Jordanian desert or in Lebanon for 12 years to return home, the regime is gone. Add to that a whole generation that has never been to school. They have never been given an opportunity to live a normal human life. So, these people must be compensated.

Destruction of Documents

*Do you worry that the fate of the victims of Seydnaya Prison will be the same as those of the Hama massacre?

This leads us to a problem that happened after Damascus’ liberation from the criminal tyrant Assad. The chaos that ensued in the first few days after his ouster led to the loss of a lot of documents and evidence. Of course, I am not blaming relatives who were frantically searching for their loved ones. They are justified for and had every right to feel that way. But I refuse that for you to receive your right, you deny others of theirs. The destruction of documents means that we won’t have evidence that implicates the criminals. So, you just denied relatives of victims their right to see the butcher who killed their son held to account.

Relatives entering the prisons wasn’t the only way these documents were destroyed. Some places were left in bad shape, and some were burned down later by unknown people. So, we know that some people are deliberately doing this with the aim of destroying these documents. Bashar al-Assad and the other criminals are probably very happy to see evidence destroyed this way and prison doors being flung open without documenting who the detainees are. We saw how prisoners walked on foot, naked, from Seydnaya to al-Tall. That’s a 3-km walk in the cold night.

*Do you compare Assad’s downfall to Saddam Hussein’s?

I don’t think you can compare the two. First, Assad was toppled by the Syrian people and by terror. Assad was toppled before the revolutionary forces made it to Damascus. All the conditions for his collapse were there. He was in his weakest state, and he was ousted by heroic Syrians, who entered Damascus after liberating Hama and Homs. Other Syrians had also worked on isolating the regime politically and economically by working with rights groups.

The situation was not like Iraq. A comparison between Assad and any other case from our time or in the past wrongs the other party. I don’t think Nero even deserves to be compared to Assad.

*So, is Nero better?

“Better” or “worse” are not the right words for this. I am saying that Bashar al-Assad was crazier and more criminal than Nero. There’s no room here to use the word “better”.

*The interview concludes on Thursday.